Elmira's Homeless Problem Superthread

[Chris 3,211]

To repeat the initial question as it pertains to this topic: What changes can or should be made to the mental health care system to alleviate the mentally I’ll being stuck on the streets? Or, how do we help them in any other manner besides long term hospitalization or institutionalization?

[MsKreed 1,570]

Last Monday, the Standing Committees for the County Legislature began with a presentation by Catholic Charities of Chemung/Schuyler Counties

Link: HERE

Even with poor sound quality on my end, I thought it was a very informative 50 minutes. They explained some of the......umm, let's politely call them "challenges" that the organization and staff faces.

They covered the state mandates, recent closing of the shelter, various housing options they are using, and their plans for St Peter and Paul's Church that they have been utilizing and are in the process of purchasing.

[Chris 3,211]

[MsKreed 1,570]

Reports say it was the homeless encampment burning, but no cause determined yet. 

I wonder if the crews cleaning up debris encountered dangerous flammable, or are the voluntarily unhoused are back already?

[KarenK 503]

7 hours ago, MsKreed said:

Reports say it was the homeless encampment burning, but no cause determined yet. 

I wonder if the crews cleaning up debris encountered dangerous flammable, or are the voluntarily unhoused are back already?

Opposite sides of the bridge.  Fire was on the North side which they had not gone to clean up yet.  They cleaned out the South side earlier this week.

[Hal 553]

Just a thought . 
Conditions are/were ripe for the possibility of a Spontaneous Combustion situation. With the amount of trash in piles of plastic garbage bags ( containing God only knows what ) and other combustible items piled atop and around the bags , the compression coupled with the ongoing hot temps . I know , at first blush , it looks like a “ i’ll burn my shit before they take it “ but I guess we just wait for the Fire Marshal’s report . 

[MsKreed 1,570]

When they stated people could be arrested and the DEC needed to clean up the  "flood plains", I guess I assumed they were completely cleared out. 

Why wouldn't the same environmental concerns apply under all the bridges, on both sides?

 

[Hal 553]

Guess I am confused as well . DEC owns and is responsible for the flood plains , up to and including the spaces and sidewalks under the bridge ? So why does the City get the bill for cleanups?! 
Should not the DEC ,as owners , be responsible for taking steps to keep out the bridge people, making arrests etc . 
Was the cleanup started on the South end started with intentions of continuing to the North immediately thereafter or is there some sort of agreement or easement between the City and DEC due to the Riverfront Park walkway making the City responsible for the North end ?! 
Or are the City and the DEC simply “ volleying for serve “ if so this will just be another Charlie Foxtrot for us to sit back and enjoy as usual . 

[KarenK 503]

5 hours ago, MsKreed said:

When they stated people could be arrested and the DEC needed to clean up the  "flood plains", I guess I assumed they were completely cleared out. 

Why wouldn't the same environmental concerns apply under all the bridges, on both sides?

 

It does and they do.  They just started this week and only got the one side of one bridge.  It is a proverbial shit show garbage dump under all of them.  Took backhoes and dump trucks to clean out just the one side.

They are supposed to do them all when time and staffing allows

[Elizabeth Whitehouse 22]

Not being in Elmira anymore, I was unaware of the fire.

While I can see how debris can accumulate in a homeless encampment and present a hazard, I am unhappy with the City's actions to clear out the encampments. Where are the homeless supposed to go?

[MsKreed 1,570]

They could choose to abide by basic rules of safety and security (prohibiting drugs/weapons) and accept services from one of facilities and programs available.

[KarenK 503]

15 minutes ago, MsKreed said:

They could choose to abide by basic rules of safety and security (prohibiting drugs/weapons) and accept services from one of facilities and programs available.

Well that's a novel idea!!   

[Adam 527]

3 hours ago, Elizabeth Whitehouse said:

Where are the homeless supposed to go?

to the shelters that are still in the area and abide by the rules set in place

 

[Elizabeth Whitehouse 22]

As far as I know, Adam, there is only one shelter - Catholic charities dormitory for 47 single men.  Out of some 360 known homeless.

correct me if I am wrong.

[command_prompt 298]

On 7/15/2024 at 1:24 PM, Elizabeth Whitehouse said:

Not being in Elmira anymore, I was unaware of the fire.

While I can see how debris can accumulate in a homeless encampment and present a hazard

I wouldn't call couches "debris." https://www.cityofelmira.net/CivicAlerts.aspx?AID=61

 

[Elizabeth Whitehouse 22]

Nor would I. I would call them personal possessions, which the city has no right to seize or burn.

[MsKreed 1,570]

The City didn’t burn anything. The “possessions” caught fire due to the negligence of the trespassers camping under the bridge....(or arson/meth cooking).

 

The City put its staff in harms way to extinguish the fire....inhaling noxious fumes from piles of poly-plastics and countless other unknown harmful flammables.  

There's a reason why the DEC (the agency we have tasked with trying to preserve our precious environment) ordered the encampment cleared out. Aside from the disregard for polluting the water by staying there, the encampment is now responsible further senseless damage to the environment.

Edited July 16 by MsKreed

[Elizabeth Whitehouse 22]

So what is your solution to the very real problem of homelessness in Elmira?

And what do you do to preserve  our "precious environment"?

[MsKreed 1,570]

35 minutes ago, Elizabeth Whitehouse said:

So what is your solution to the very real problem of homelessness in Elmira?

The voluntarily homeless could alleviate a lot of the problem if some of them were willing to do this:

On 7/15/2024 at 1:37 PM, MsKreed said:

They could choose to abide by basic rules of safety and security (prohibiting drugs/weapons) and accept services from one of facilities and programs available.

There are numerous programs (aside from temporary shelters) that provide housing, assist with job placement, offer mental health and substance abuse help, and assist in applying for public assistance services.

The recipients of those services just need to be willing to follow rules and put at least some effort into behaving like a civilized human beings. I've known far too many people facing "hard times" (including myself). There is help. New York State is abundant with help. But it's not (and shouldn't be) unconditional help.

Whether the "hard times" are partially due uncontrollable circumstances, or purely from poor choices.....making more poor choices will never improve the situation. Not accepting help because one refuses to agree to the "conditions" (basic human behavior, in a civilized environment) is a choice. 

 

35 minutes ago, Elizabeth Whitehouse said:

And what do you do to preserve  our "precious environment"?

Well, just off the top of my head....I don’t dump trash and noxious waste into the river every day as a lifestyle.

Instead I reuse/recycle whatever possible, and properly dispose of other trash. And whenever I can, I also make an effort pick up trash that people with no respect toss on roads and other public places.

 

OH...And when a horrific fire breaks out, I don't make wild false accusations about local government "burning" stuff. 

Edited July 16 by MsKreed

[Twin Tiers Living 489]

Posts concerning the fire under the Clemens Center Parkway bridge and the homeless have been moved here.

[Adam 527]

On 7/15/2024 at 11:50 PM, Elizabeth Whitehouse said:

correct me if I am wrong.

https://www.mytwintiers.com/news-cat/new-dormitory-homeless-shelter-to-open-in-elmira/

https://www.wskg.org/regional-news/2024-05-09/catholic-charities-of-chemung-and-schuyler-opens-new-homeless-shelter-in-elmira

https://www.catholiccharitiescs.org/find-help/homeless-services/

https://www.stargazette.com/story/news/local/2024/05/08/elmira-new-homeless-shelter-catholic-charities/73611227007/

these links indicate that "individuals" of either sex are eligible to use the shelter on High street.

https://www.mytwintiers.com/news-cat/482k-per-month-the-cost-of-homeless-housing-in-chemung-county/

the above link describes the almost half million dollars/month spent by the County(taxpayers) to house families in 191 rooms across 11 motels in the area.

[Briggs 17]

On 7/16/2024 at 4:48 PM, MsKreed said:

The City didn’t burn anything. The “possessions” caught fire due to the negligence of the trespassers camping under the bridge....(or arson/meth cooking).

 

The City put its staff in harms way to extinguish the fire....inhaling noxious fumes from piles of poly-plastics and countless other unknown harmful flammables.  

There's a reason why the DEC (the agency we have tasked with trying to preserve our precious environment) ordered the encampment cleared out. Aside from the disregard for polluting the water by staying there, the encampment is now responsible further senseless damage to the environment.

How do you trespass on public property?  

[MsKreed 1,570]

11 minutes ago, Briggs said:

How do you trespass on public property? 

There are many (in fact, most) public properties where people are prohibited from free and unrestricted 24/7 use and access.

We all know that City Hall and State or US Capitols are “public property”.....but we can be arrested for trespassing if we’re there outside of permissible hours.  

And that also applies to outdoor public spaces, as I mentioned in the Topic about the SCOTUS ruling that municipalities are legally allowed to ban homeless encampments.......

Quote

 

State and Federal parks and forests (always have and still do) absolutely prohibit the kind of encampments and vagrancy that this ruling has simply extended to municipal "public land".

The homeless aren't allowed to take up residence at Yellowstone, Letchworth or WG State Park,etc.... and no one has seemed to offer any legal challenge to those policies. 

Researching where I'm allowed to stay (in my fully equipped RV) is something I've spent considerable time looking into. If I want to "camp" on state or federal (taxpayer owned) land, I'm often required to pay an admission fee. With or without a fee, I could face fines and possibly jail time if I "camp" beyond the allowed time (anywhere from 3 to 14 days). And even within the permitted time limits, I'd still be subject to steep penalties if I leave any litter behind. 

So how is it "oppressive" or inhumane for a City or County to impose restrictions on the same behavior that state or federal authorities have set for taxpayer owned property that they control? 

 

 

[Twin Tiers Living 489]

As of last look, the northbound lanes of the Clemens Center Bridge remain closed. 

[Kevin 456]

On 7/23/2024 at 5:02 PM, Briggs said:

How do you trespass on public property?  

School property is also considered private owned for public uae.