SCOTUS Allows Banning Homeless Camps: How Could This Affect Elmira?

[command_prompt 298]

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In a profoundly disappointing ruling, the U.S. Supreme Court today decided that the US Constitution does not protect homeless people against cruel and unusual punishment, even when they have no choice to sleep in public using things like blankets or pillows. 

Arresting or fining people for trying to survive is expensive, counterproductive, and cruel. This inhumane ruling, which goes against the values of nearly three-quarters of Americans, will make homelessness worse in Grants Pass and nationwide. Cities are now even more empowered to neglect proven housing-based solutions and to arrest or fine those with no choice but to sleep outdoors. While we are disappointed, we are not surprised that this Supreme Court ruled against the interests of our poorest neighbors.

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Elmira officials have been unsuccessful with addressing our own version of Ithaca's "jungle". Our homeless prefer to reside in "Waterfront Apartments," (under Clemens Center Parkway bridge), although they will not look down upon breaking into and squatting in an abandoned dwelling. How will this ruling affect our area?

Do we, Elmira residents, have any responsibilities - ethical, moral or otherwise -  to help folks who, for many reasons, put themselves in those situations, and if yes, what can we do as a community? Will we reach a breaking point, or just accept Wisner Park's gazebos are not available to the taxpayers, and move on?

[Ann 439]

I did not think being offered housing, food and other assistance was cruel and unusual treatment.  If an individual does not want to accept the help offered to get back on their feet but chooses to live outside, go for it.  Just do it out in the woods someplace.  They’re entitled to their lifestyle but they don’t have the right to interfere with others, nor do they have the right to squat in and destroy others’ properties and that includes public areas.  
Clean these encampments out and make them uninhabitable.  If not allowed to continue residing under the bridges perhaps they’ll take the help offered.

[MsKreed 1,570]

44 minutes ago, Ann said:

If an individual does not want to accept the help offered to get back on their feet but chooses to live outside, go for it.  Just do it out in the woods someplace.  They’re entitled to their lifestyle but they don’t have the right to interfere with others, nor do they have the right to squat in and destroy others’ properties and that includes public areas. 

It's funny that when I saw the original post, the exact thought that struck me was the fact that State and Federal parks and forests (always have and still do) absolutely prohibit the kind of encampments and vagrancy that this ruling has simply extended to municipal "public land".

The homeless aren't allowed to take up residence at Yellowstone, Letchworth or WG State Park,etc.... and no one has seemed to offer any legal challenge to those policies. 

Researching where I'm allowed to stay (in my fully equipped RV) is something I've spent considerable time looking into. If I want to "camp" on state or federal (taxpayer owned) land, I'm often required to pay an admission fee. With or without a fee, I could face fines and possibly jail time if I "camp" beyond the allowed time (anywhere from 3 to 14 days). And even within the time limits, I'd still be subject to steep penalties if I leave any litter behind. 

So how is it "oppressive" or inhumane for a City or County to impose restrictions on the same behavior that state or federal authorities have set for taxpayer owned property that they control? 

[command_prompt 298]

1 hour ago, Ann said:

If an individual does not want to accept the help offered to get back on their feet but chooses to live outside, go for it.  Just do it out in the woods someplace. 

They won't. They need civilization. They need access to stores' dumpsters, redeemable 5 cent cans, copper pipes they can cut up and sell, same as bikes. Even the most drugged-out individual needs food. Hiking a mile to the nearest housing development (in search of something to steal and pawn) is not high on their list.

Wisner Park gazebo squatters should not yell at and/or threaten me if I walk too close to either structure. I should not fear for my life if I use the hiking path on the north side of Chemung River. I should also not be told that "if you don't like that the homeless live there, don't go there." 

And yet, we are encouraged to "show them respect/compassion," whatever that means.

[Hal 553]

We all have a God ( insert Name or Entity) given Right of Choice . Numbers of course not available but from what I see and hear locally there is a higher percentage of those making the Choice to live the way they do without responsibilities as the majority of us do. I owe them nothing , there are ways and programs for anyone to pull themselves out of the situation they are in they just need to avail themselves of the help offered , for which we that accept life’s responsibilities pay . Let me add here , with the exception of those needing mental treatment and that's a whole other ball of wax . 
Now , if the Law of the Land makes such a Ruling then so be it ! As MsKreed posted , she , when camping , has the responsibility to obey the Rules of the particular area she or anyone else is enjoying. So the bridge people , homeless , parking garage stairway folks need to be held to the same rules , now Law . 

[command_prompt 298]

Coincidentally, as our discussion has started gaining momentum, this one has popped up (nota bene, I am not promoting EiC in any way, just pointing out the homeless-are-gentle-giant-saints/the-employed-and-housed-are-privileged dichotomy, prevalent on social media.

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/y1TwHsuu1HAYNafB/

It's perfectly fine if you want to painstakingly crochet blankets for the Waterfront Apartments' residents. Kudos to you for being loving and compassionate and selfless. Helping the less fortunate is commendable, but you have to understand that most homeless folks who break into vacant buildings and not just looking for a place to sleep. 

[Twin Tiers Living 489]

[Hal 553]

And here is the City’s answer  … “ unfortunately “  There is LITTLE WE CAN DO … in other words , live with it ! So essentially they are thumbing their noses at the Supreme Court and,And putting the responsibility onto the County Legislature in the next paragraph ?! Please correct me if I am seeing this incorrectly.

Edited July 2 by Hal

[Chris 3,211]

On 6/29/2024 at 10:09 AM, command_prompt said:

Do we, Elmira residents, have any responsibilities - ethical, moral or otherwise -  to help folks who, for many reasons, put themselves in those situations,

No. I don't remember exactly when it was, it may have been last summer, there was a story or something about taking bottled water to the homeless under the bridges because it was so hot. IN the picture, there were numerous beer cans and other beverage containers laying all over. 

The mentally ill person who can't take care of themselves but is on the streets because politicians decidedwe needed more "feel good" legislation, and closed the in-patient facility? That's one thing, of course we should help that person. People who sit around all day drinking cheap beer? Forget it. 

On 6/29/2024 at 5:35 PM, command_prompt said:

Wisner Park gazebo squatters should not yell at and/or threaten me if I walk too close to either structure.

When working, I see that group there all the time and wonder if anyone else realizes what an unwelcoming picture that paints for an out of towner who gets a couple slices at Vincenzo's for lunch and wants a nice place to sit and eat it. 

And for what it's worth, I don't understand the hoarding type behavior you see in pictures of these encampments along the river or wherever else. If a couple people had a small, tidy campsite, hell, I could almost be okay with that. But wandering around the city all day with shopping carts full of plain junk and taking them back to pile them up near their hovel? I don't get it. And that's if the junk makes it there. It's not uncommon to see grocery carts along the street or tipped over and left where they fell. 

[Twin Tiers Living 489]

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ELMIRA, N.Y. (WETM) — A bucket loader was seen taking load after load of items and other debris from under the Clemens Center Bridge Monday morning, as Elmira Police said that arrests could be made in the future.

The price tag for the cleanup on Monday is unknown, but Elmira Police told 18 News that if people are found under the bridges again they could be subject to arrest.

 

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[Hal 553]

5 minutes ago, Twin Tiers Living said:

but Elmira Police told 18 News that if people are found under the bridges again they could be subject to arrest.

COULD be arrested , no , Will be arrested… why leave the door open ?! This wishy washy crap is the reason the bridge people go right back time and again ! 

[Kevin 456]

Isn't Councilman Brinn a pastor at the Park Church by Wisner park? I wonder how many voluntarily unsheltered they have taken in and allowed to live in the rooms no longer used? It's a big church and should be able to house a lot of people.